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    boric acid oil additive

    I am wondering if anyone has experimented with oil additives such as boric acid?

    #2
    When I get some free time I will explain with links; however, I want to see if anyone else has researched oil additives. I am not talking about products but experience with your own trials. I just noticed the thread was moved, but I will give quantified results after I experiment with my second round of such.

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      #3
      why not just buy good oil im pretty sure profesional's have already done experience on oil additives and most of them you lose 2% of your HP... just buy the good stuff (royal purple fully synthetic)

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        #4
        www.bobistheoilguy.com.


        save your money. buy good oil and change it regularly.

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          #5
          Originally posted by 90-JDM-integra View Post
          why not just buy good oil im pretty sure profesional's have already done experience on oil additives and most of them you lose 2% of your HP... just buy the good stuff (royal purple fully synthetic)
          Royal Purple isnt backed by the API i wouldnt run it, have alot of customers who come in to print there service reports and the manufactures wont back them on there warranty cause they used RP. just my .02c better off running a Mobil 1 or other full Synthetic oil Brand

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            #6
            Originally posted by Stevo-DA View Post
            Royal Purple isnt backed by the API i wouldnt run it, have alot of customers who come in to print there service reports and the manufactures wont back them on there warranty cause they used RP. just my .02c better off running a Mobil 1 or other full Synthetic oil Brand
            sure?

            http://www.royalpurple.com/motor-oil.html

            "Royal Purple’s motor oils for passenger cars and trucks are API licensed. For those seeking enhanced performance in high performance vehicles not under warranty, we recommend our XPR – Extreme Performance and Racing motor oil."

            http://www.royalpurple.com/faqs-racing.html

            "However, Royal Purple’s racing oils do not conform to API and / or ILSAC licensing requirements and should not be used when vehicle warranty is an issue."

            "Royal Purple’s motor oils are formulated to provide unparalleled performance and protection and comply with API / ILSAC specifications. Its racing oils vary in viscosity and formulation as compared to the SAE motor oils to provide the greatest performance gains possible without regard to API, SAE and / or ILSAC specifications."

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              #7
              thats what i heard from the customers who come in and my boss said its cause they arent API cert, but i guess he was wrong thanks for the correct information

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                #8
                Originally posted by 90-JDM-integra View Post
                why not just buy good oil im pretty sure profesional's have already done experience on oil additives and most of them you lose 2% of your HP... just buy the good stuff (royal purple fully synthetic)
                Just because "professionals" have done testing by no means says that there isn't room for improvement, or that their requirements and purpose are the same as yours. Read into the properties of boric acid and how it reacts with metals and oxygen under high temp/pressure conditions. The problem to overcome is particle size of the chemical suspended in the oil.

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                  #9
                  Originally posted by darin d View Post
                  Just because "professionals" have done testing by no means says that there isn't room for improvement, or that their requirements and purpose are the same as yours. Read into the properties of boric acid and how it reacts with metals and oxygen under high temp/pressure conditions. The problem to overcome is particle size of the chemical suspended in the oil.
                  well actually they did testing under towing daily driving and racing and they lost 2% across the whole powerband under all circumstances and sorry but when trying to get the best oil u should use a fully synthetic brand with no additives when you add additives it also messes with your oils chemicals and formula and actually makes it worse .... additives don't test there stuff on every brand of oil!!

                  http://www.carbibles.com/additives.html

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                    #10
                    That link has nothing to do with the use of boric acid and a dry lubricant or suspended as a particulate, and it doesn't seem to me that you have a grasp of basic chemestry. I am talking about running a mixture of castor oil with variable amounts of suspended boric acid micro particles. These particles form boric oxides that bond to metalic surfaces decreasing shear and friction.
                    Like I said read into the properties of boric acid before you start regurgitating irrelivent information.

                    here is one article that you may find interesting.

                    http://luboron.com/pdf/FormationMechanisms.pdf

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                      #11
                      this argument is stupid.

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                        #12
                        Agreed, since none of you have even approached the topic. I like g2ic, but there are very few on here willing to discuss anything outside of basic mechanics. I am no expert, but there is always room for improvement. Many of the newer advances in technology will not see mainstream applications for many years after their discovery.

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                          #13
                          Originally posted by darin d View Post
                          Agreed, since none of you have even approached the topic. I like g2ic, but there are very few on here willing to discuss anything outside of basic mechanics. I am no expert, but there is always room for improvement. Many of the newer advances in technology will not see mainstream applications for many years after their discovery.
                          Thats not it at all. YOU came on here, posted a thread asking if any of us knew anythign or used boric acid OR oil additives. we're flat out telling you to forget about oil additives. if you are sold on them, use em. but when you come on ehre asking advice and info, don't get all butt hurt and defensive when we disagree.

                          as far as im concerned oil additives, boric acid included, are not worth the money, and most of them ahve been proven NOT to work.

                          boric acids properties when mixed with petroleum, note the word im using, is SIMILAR to products like ZMAX, soaking into and creating al ower coefficient of friction on metal surfaces. However, it also has an effect on the seal created between the piston ring and cyl wall, over time causing excess blowby and decresed performance, though your engine may last longer, you're not getting a good p2w seal.

                          in addition modern day oils have additives added to them in the manufacturing process. those additives are not really meant to be messed with, and by that i meaen, the addition of additives after the fact. it actually reduces the effectiveness of the oil to begin with. raw petroleum acts differently when zinc and other additives are added to it.

                          in my experience the tests conducted with boric acid are done with raw oil or vegetable oil, neither of which really can give us a real look into how it works in an engine. in addition when boric acid is taken out of the environment (i.e. it's sitting in oil not moving, not exposed to heat, as it would if the engiens turned off, it does what?)

                          furthermore the coeff of friction range (the amonut its lowered) is so small, you're better off just getting a higher quality oil. it's something around .1.

                          finally the uses of boric acid. antiseptic, insecticide, and the like. in the mainstream it's not used as a lubricant, prob for a good reason.



                          SO.

                          I choose not to risk trying a product until i've researched it completely. when a bunch of auto gurus tell me to stay away from additives as a general rule, i stay away from them.

                          get a better oil if youre concerned about lubrication.
                          Last edited by icemanGSR; 07 Aug 2009, 17:14:41.

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                            #14
                            That is somewhat more along the lines of what I was inquiring. I am not asking about off the counter products, meerly the use of chemical grade boric acid filtered on a 10-15 micron particle size as a friction modifier. It has been known to be used in dry lubrication applications, and it's properties have been studied; however, I have seen little long term quantitative studies of the effects in an internal combustion motor.

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